California Gov. Gavin Newsom speaks with Jonathan Karl of ABC News. (ABC News)

(WASHINGTON) — California Democratic Gov. Gavin Newsom said he is “deeply concerned” about remarks from President Donald Trump and his close allies about possibly seeking a third term in 2028.

Newsom, who is considered a potential 2028 presidential contender himself, was asked by ABC News Chief Washington Correspondent Jonathan Karl if he takes such talk seriously.

“They’re not screwing around,” Newsom said.

Trump has mused several times about running for president again, including as recently as Monday, when he told reporters on Air Force One that he would “love to do it” despite it being barred by the Constitution.

The 22nd Amendment expressly forbids a president from being elected to office more than twice.

Last week, Steve Bannon, the former Trump White House adviser and conservative media provocateur, said in an interview with The Economist that “there’s a plan” and Trump “is going to get a third term” though he didn’t share any details.

Here’s a transcript of the exchange between Newsom and Karl in the interview that will air on Wednesday in which Newsom talks about his meeting with Trump in the Oval Office in February.

KARL: “Bannon is talking Trump running again 2028 and you said Trump was talking about his fourth term?”

NEWSOM: “He was showing me a photo of — I turned around, he was at the Resolute [Desk], and he goes, ‘Look over there.’ I’m like, and I literally looked and I looked him. I’m like, ‘OK.’ I said, ‘Third term?’ He goes, ‘No, fourth.’ And it was FDR’s painting up on the wall. I’m like, here we go. I said, ‘We’re perfect little sheep, aren’t we?’ He’s laughing because we are. He knows exactly what we’re going to do. There’s a French, I don’t know what the, I can’t say it in French — poem that loosely says, ‘He pisses on the grasshoppers to hear them sing.’ And that’s Donald Trump.”

KARL: “So do you take that seriously? Do you think he is going to try to stay in office?”

NEWSOM: “What I’ve noticed, what we all have experienced, I hope we’re absorbing in our souls, because we’re talking about the soul of America, is, I don’t think he takes himself seriously, but he iterates. He throws things out. And he plays with it, and he sees how people react, and it manifests. Meaning, once a mind is stretched, it never goes back to its original form. And that’s my concern. The more we’re talking about this — and we need to be. Look at what he’s doing with masked agents. Look what he’s doing federalizing the Guard. Look what he’s doing to intimidate and voter suppression. Look what he’s going to do with the DOJ. Look what he’s trying to do to rig the elections: North Carolina, Missouri, down there, next Florida, not just in Texas. Look what he’s doing in terms of the $230 million that is, apparently, his from his DOJ. All the pardoning, all the this — this great grift, the biggest, most corrupt administration in history. Not just the $400 million plane, but the billion dollars of your tax money as we’re cutting food stamps to pay for the damn plane so he can take that toy home with his foundation when he’s 93 or whatever he’s done with his fourth or fifth term. I’m deeply concerned about it. And guys like Bannon, they’re not screwing around. They’re not screwing around.”

Copyright © 2025, ABC Audio. All rights reserved.